110,000 signatures in 5 days.
Sign here if you'd like the government to keep the original, vastly superior but slightly more expensive NBN:
www.change.org/p/the-liberal-party-of-australia-reconsider-your-plan-for-a-fttn-nbn-in-favour-of-a-superior-ftth-nbn
An article: www.abc.net.au/news/2013-09-10/university-student-petition-to-scrap-nbn-takes-off-online/4949372
Where is the third documents to scrap both plans all together ?
Couldn't we just leave this as is ? Business model not government enterprise ?
When I needed broadband for my business I had fiber lay down to my door premises within week or two at no cost for me at all ?
The only problem that last few meters was on the copper but that could / should be negotiated without the need for complete new enterprise.
Select to expand quoteevlPanda said..
110,000 signatures
which mean that
23,177,000 - 110,000 = 23,067,000 didn't support this idea 
or
99.5 % of entire population
Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.
Select to expand quotepepe47 said..
Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.
That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.
I'm with Macroscien on this one.
Although working in IT and the lure of gigabit + network speeds, the economics of fibre to the premises does not add up.
The NBN is a nation building bit of infrastructure akin to the 21st century version of the Snowy River scheme, but with mounting national debt, the fibre to the node model is cheaper & faster to deploy. The last hop to the premises can be done at a later date, or if you can't wait, run it yourself or let business provide plans that include this.
Lets spend the estimated $15 billion saving on something else.
Select to expand quoteMacroscien said..pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.
Nor are they eligible to vote But they're still part of the population equation.
Select to expand quotepepe47 said..
NorMacroscien said..pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.
Nor are they eligible to vote But they're still part of the population equation.
You missed the point.
We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country.
Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait.
But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN,
that demand could not be met
Select to expand quoteLets spend the estimated $15 billion saving on something else.
Why not just save all the money and let business build everything? Yee-hah!
Select to expand quoteMacroscien said..pepe47 said.. NorYou missed the point. We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country. Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait. But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN, that demand could not be metMacroscien said.. Nor are they eligible to vote pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet. But they're still part of the population equation.
No, I don't think I'm missing the point. I think YOU may be missing the final tally of the petition. What they're saying is that the tally so far, is 110,000 signatures within the relatively short span of 5 days.
Then we might be able to revisit the percentage of the population eligible to vote.
Select to expand quotepepe47 said..
Then we might be able to revisit the percentage of the population eligible to vote.
Right , there are proven methods to reduce remaining 99.5% opposition to just couple %.
You may need WMD, be quick there are going cheaply after Assad is liquidating the stock 
Macro, Westoz, we've been... ahem... robustly discussing.. the virtues of the NBN on here for months. Please don't come in now with nonsense and make everyone start all over again with the same arguements.
FTTN is *not* faster to deploy, just sounds it on paper before you start doing it. It requires pits, power, nodes with UPS/backup batteries, and council permission for 80,000 sites. NBN rollout guys will tell you it's faster just to run the cable.
Economics add up - never costs anywhere near the same to do things piecemeal, cheapest way is always in bulk, do it at once. go into your street pits ONCE and pull all the fibre, not 47 individual times as you make people pay.
Total costings, inc copper maintenance, show FTTN a very similar cost. So why not do it right? And avoid ugly fridge cabinets on every other street corner while you're at it?
Micro - it's not about home downloads it's about replacing copper with the next gen, breaking telstra's monopoly, and thinking ahead.
There's the 20 second recap, please go read all the other NBN threads.
Select to expand quotekiteboy dave said..
Macro, Westoz, we've been... ahem... robustly discussing.. the virtues of the NBN on here for months. Please don't come in now with nonsense and make everyone start all over again with the same arguements.
FTTN is *not* faster to deploy, just sounds it on paper before you start doing it. It requires pits, power, nodes with UPS/backup batteries, and council permission for 80,000 sites. NBN rollout guys will tell you it's faster just to run the cable.
Economics add up - never costs anywhere near the same to do things piecemeal, cheapest way is always in bulk, do it at once. go into your street pits ONCE and pull all the fibre, not 47 individual times as you make people pay.
Total costings, inc copper maintenance, show FTTN a very similar cost. So why not do it right? And avoid ugly fridge cabinets on every other street corner while you're at it?
Micro - it's not about home downloads it's about replacing copper with the next gen, breaking telstra's monopoly, and thinking ahead.
There's the 20 second recap, please go read all the other NBN threads.
And jamming one right up that decrepit ol obnoxious mongrel who thinks he has the right to run this country from his crystal tower in the US.
Select to expand quotekiteboy dave said..
breaking telstra's monopoly,.
fine but before I do that( read all the threads back) could you remind in short
how are you going to benefit on replacement - one monopoly with another one government one this time ? What guaranties that one is better then another one ?
I am not attacking technical aspect but organisational. Telstra could provide you with fiber straight to your computers too.
Probably everything finish like breaking power companies monopoly. Now you end up paying separate to electricity generators, network operator, retailer.
Ends up paying 45c for electricity worth in real terms 6- 8 c/ kw ( that is what they pay you back for your solar FIT)
It won't happen.
Why do you think Murdoch wanted the Libs in so bad? It's simply to protect cable TV sales. Every other country with fast net (read most) cable TV sales have fallen heavily.
It was a major election issue so they will just say they were given a mandate that Australia did not want it. Game over regardless if Murdoch media presented all of the benefits of the slower slightly cheaper version...
The extra cost of doing this job properly is spent over the years the project takes to complete. 15billion over 10 successive bugets is a drop in the ocean. For some reason we do need to increase defence spending though...
Select to expand quoteMacroscien said..evlPanda said..
110,000 signatures
which mean that
23,177,000 - 110,000 = 23,067,000 didn't support this idea
or
99.5 % of entire population
99.5 % just didn't see pandas post for where to find the petition 
How far have we gone with the NBN so far? ie; regardless of your position on the subject - is it worth pulling out now or best to finish it and cop the costs?
Spend the cash on providing a reliable and consistent wireless service. Cables are so old fashioned.
Select to expand quotepepe47 said..Macroscien said..pepe47 said.. NorYou missed the point. We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country. Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait. But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN, that demand could not be metMacroscien said.. Nor are they eligible to vote pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet. But they're still part of the population equation.
No, I don't think I'm missing the point. I think YOU may be missing the final tally of the petition. What they're saying is that the tally so far, is 110,000 signatures within the relatively short span of 5 days.
Then we might be able to revisit the percentage of the population eligible to vote.
Tell you what -
Lets have a mandatory, country wide vote on the issue, then there can be no speculation about who saw the petition.
Lets have a choice in the vote -
box 1 : tick to spend $40b to connect every property in the country to fibre, whether somebody lives in the property or not and lets, for the sake of the argument, call this box the Allied Lending out other peoples money People (or ALP)
Box 2 : tick if you want something else that is even more stupid, lets call this option the Coalition of Looneys and Numbskulls (or LN Coalition for short)
then several other boxes for people who have no idea what they actually want, one of which we could call the Green with envy at the other parties who know what they want Mob (or 'Greens' for short)
Now - lets make everyone who is not insane tick at least one box and see what the real result is.
Crazy idea I know.
Seem to me like in Western Australia all the rich places like applecross got it and all the places that really needed it or dont even have internet didnt get a look at.
Im in. mobile connection is faster than my lan connection
I must sign. O goody I can beat that guy online gaming by .00045 seconds
We must have the worlds fastest internet, so I can download a movie in .00044 seconds.
I don't care how much it costs, give it to me, I think I will vote twice. like at the election.
Since digging and laying cables is the most expensive part of that NBN work shouldn't we already put two or more fibres to every home instead of just one ? We could double the speed even further with this minimal expense.
One fiber then will serve us SuperExtra High Definition Movies, next will be used for gaming exclusively, two thicker cables could bring more porn and one tinny for email should do just fine.
Ohh I forget one thing, multiply that by amount of family members too.
Didn't you all realized that the weak point is already human not the hardware ?
The same race was with computer processor performance.
Regardless what is the GHz processor speed and amount of cores - the dumb end user will not produce any better result that his IQ is.
Get yourself extra brain neuron transfusion mates for that 50 billions.
Select to expand quoteHarrow said..
Already 180,000 and counting...
Wake me up when you reach ...
23,177,000.00 divided by 2 plus 1
Select to expand quoteMacroscien said..
Since digging and laying cables is the most expensive part of that NBN work shouldn't we already put two or more fibres to every home instead of just one ? We could double the speed even further with this minimal expense.
One fiber then will serve us SuperExtra High Definition Movies, next will be used for gaming exclusively, two thicker cables could bring more porn and one tinny for email should do just fine.
Ohh I forget one thing, multiply that by amount of family members too.
Didn't you all realized that the weak point is already human not the hardware ?
The same race was with computer processor performance.
Regardless what is the GHz processor speed and amount of cores - the dumb end user will not produce any better result that his IQ is.
Get yourself extra brain neuron transfusion mates for that 50 billions.
If I can give you some technical information, usually 'fiber' comes with a couple of cores, usually more, depending on what you need and how thick you want the cable to be. In the same way that you have multiple pairs in copper twisted pair cabling, you have spare cores and often don't use them.
So, in reality, the cable planned in the NBN probably already has more cores than are needed.
Of course, there is no need to double speed, because you also double the number of ports you require on your infrastructure, and the number of terminations.
You don't seem to know much about the technology, but you are certain that balloons are better.
Select to expand quoteCMC said..
It won't happen.
Why do you think Murdoch wanted the Libs in so bad? It's simply to protect cable TV sales. Every other country with fast net (read most) cable TV sales have fallen heavily.
It was a major election issue so they will just say they were given a mandate that Australia did not want it. Game over regardless if Murdoch media presented all of the benefits of the slower slightly cheaper version...
Pay TV subscriptions is declining in Australia anyway. A fiber optic network would not have much of an effect one way or another. Most subscribers to pay TV got it in the nineties or early naughties. There probably have not been that many new subscribers since then. Check out the ads on Foxtel, 90% of them are for funeral insurance. Older people are their target market. The main problem pay TV has is not the NBN, its the fact most of the shows on it are rubbish and younger people have found alternatives with existing technology.
If we get the NBN I really doubt my Internet/TV/Music consumption would change all that much. Right now I can download a HD show recently aired in America quicker than I can watch it. This is with ADSL2. No fiber to the home. Of course this speed is not available everywhere. What should be a priority is improving access in areas where decent broadband Internet is not currently available. That would be the best bang for the buck.
