Hi Guys,
Being a intermediate 4 line bow (turbo diesel 2) kite ride I will be trying out a 5 line C kite (North Vegas 08). What are the differences when it comes to self launching, self landing and water relaunching - hate to find out the hard way! If fyou know of any other gotachas, with the kite or C let me know.
BTW if anyone has the pdf of the vegas 2008 manual (kite and bar) would be great if you could let me know will give you my email address to you can send this to me. Would be much appreciated as this is no longer available on the North web sites.
Thanks guys - Matthew
Hey MDickerson,
ive riddin both bow and c kites in the best kiteboarding rage, and also riddin the vegas 08.
as you my have herd a c kite is a little harder to relaunch, as for self landing and self launchin i didnt find much of a differences.
but beaware every kite is different and this my be the case in the vagas and the turbo diesel 2, but imp the vegase seemed very simular to the best yargas when it came to relanch ect.
the one main thing you must beaware of tho is that if u are running the vegas of a 5th line, make sure if you crush it dont let it invert or roll over it self because the 5th line will wrap itself around the kite and then you will have a few problems
also the c kites have a much smaller wind range then your bow kites, and your depower is also alot less. if u find your self tryin to fly it in lighter winds you might find the kite to be a real pain!
i hope ive helped you out in some way
other then that go out and have a go and go hard
yeaaahh
1. Wind range on a c-kite is NOT less than a bow. It's entirely kite dependent.
Some might argue that some c-kites have a greater wind range than a bow because of the ability to choke the fifth line to ride out a squall. Others would say that i'm an argumentative $h!t.
2. Relaunch on a c-kite is NOT harder than a bow, it's just a different technique.
With the kite leading edge down, pull in a bit of fifth line so the kite almost lays on it's back but doesn't quite touch the water. Then pull in about a foot of one steering line depending on which way you want to relaunch. As the kite catches wind let go of the fifth line making sure it's not tangled on anything (arm, leg, bar, etc), then your ready to relaunch.
3. North Vegas's run a tensioned fifth line. If the kite rolls on it's fifth line it'll more often than not just fall through it's lines meaning you'll have to come back to shore and re-run your lines. If it does look like it's going to roll through the fifth and cut itself in half then it's best to pull your quick release and flag out to the fifth. This will reduce the chance of any damage to the kite.
C-kites aren't anywhere near as intimidating as some might have you believe. Old c-kites (Pre-2003 4-liners) could be a bit of a handful, but any of the modern ones especially 5-liners are no trouble for most intermediate or above kiters.
If you've never flown a C Kite before and want one then I would get a lesson from someone when you first get it (even a mate who has flown them before) on the launching and relaunching methods. Its not that much more difficult but it is different and will prevent you becoming very good at treading water.......
Koma is on the money imo - the later c kites worked just fine.
As bulk said see if you can find someone who still rides a c to get some tips on things, as the rest of us have forgotten! 
Self landing and launching is the same as any kite.
launch=Fold over wingtip and pile sand on to hold kite(check youtube for vid)
landing=release safety and retrieve kite up fith line.
Simple things you should have learnt in a lesson.If you had one.
But i think these isues will be the least of your problems once you get out on the water you wil find the turning speed, riding speed are faster less depower lots less than the TD2 you will have to have a good edge to controll speed. When you stack you will be punished as the kite will not 100% depower when you let go of the bar. You will probaly find it a lot harder to go upwind and the list could go on and on. I would only recomend a c kite for an experienced rider that knows what they are about.
If you are going to take it for a test ride make sure that you dont become a pasenger keep controll of the kite and your speed let it get out of controll and you will be spearing downwind out of controll. If your not confident then dont worry about it get a hybrid or delta kite.
Waxman,
A bow kite can be launched and landed an alternative way. I know for a self launch on my bow, I haven't folded the wing tip over for atleast 12 months.
i own a 10 meter vegas 08 and this years 2010 model,
the 08 model has loads of depower... as much as any hybrid i have flown so i don't think getting over powered will be your issue unless going out in stupid conditions.. the top end of the vegas is really good but the bottom end will be disappointing if you think you can use same size kite as your t/d 2
best self launch is to fold a wingtip, another way though is to feed out the fifth line as you carry the lines across the wind window. alternatively i sometimes just relaunch like most bows kites with the catch the rear wingtip to pop the kite off the ground (prob the method you use on the td2?) but i don't do this in the top end of the kites wind range.
water launching can be a little slower than your bow but just as easy once shown. grab and pull in some 5th line and use that as well as the steering line that you want the kite to relaunch the side too.
self landing , land with the kite on its edge, unhook and with the 5th line feed it in so the kite ends up downwind.
the 08 is a great kite like the 06 was , the 2010 is good too more bottom end power but i still think the 08 was a nicer more smoother kite to ride in the waves
Thanks for all the good tips guys. Btw waxman, on my bow, I don't use the launch and land techniqes you mentioned, hence the reson I asked for input on the different techniques to be used. Thanks again - Matthew
IMO the wingtip foldover method is a little outdated and not really that suitable for beginners, a lot struggle with getting the correct attack angle on the kite so that it sits properly into the wind particularly if it is shifty or gusty , others use too little sand ( kite moves or blows away before they hook in ) or two much sand ( kite wont launch etc... ) I find the best method is the pull around method
ie: run lines out in front of the kite
before walking to the bar, pick kite up and lift it sideways over lines and slightly side on to the wind ( only slightly )
hook into bar and walk back and around ( slowly drags the kite around ) until it is in the leading edge down position with the kite catching the wind ( as opposed to facing into the wind )
check all lines are ok ( last option to make sure everthing is ok otherwise restart )
launch using the water relaunch method ie: pull outer line
Pro's : can be launched off any surface ( boat, grass, sand,( concrete is not great for the leading edge but easily done )
Cons : does drag the leading edge accross the sand ( this is all dependent on the angle which you begin with the kite) get it right and the kite will drag about 1-1.5m get it way wrong and the kite will drag 10+m
I have been using this method for about 4 years in 15knots to 35knots using both Cab Switchblades and 07 Fuels with no noticable damage to the leading edge from either the sand or grass ( one concrete launch has furred up the stitching on one kites leading edge ).
The most critical part is to check all lines once the kite is upside down before pulling the outer line to launch.
There is only one difference between launching the Fuel (C) and SB ( Bow/Hybrid) and that is that with the Fuel you sometimes need to take one or two steps towards the kite once lines are checked and it is ready for launch as this helps roll the kite slightly onto its back ( i fly my fuel on 4 lines so if you have a fifth line a bit of a pull on this should have the same effect.)
For rocky or coral covered beaches I use the fixed object method
ie: run lines out
attach bar using chicken loop to some fixed object eg: sign post, bull bar, tow bar, tree, fence etc....
return to kite pick it up like you are about to launch someone and walk it around and into the wind until it sits on wingtip at the edge of the wind window rest kite and walk back to bar and hook in, reverse the process to land.
This can also be a great way to hook your kite onto a boat..... if you boat launch and want to stop for lunch or drink or smoke etc........ kite to the boat, fly kite to the edge of the window rest wingtip on the water hook chicken loop onto boat and let the kite sit there until you are ready to go again. It is a good idea to depower your kite as much as possible when leaving it in this position as it will make it less suseptable to slight wind angle changes etc....
anyway thats the way i go about it ......might help someone 
C kites make you work hard and if you get lazy on one they will punish you. Also you will struggle if you can't edge properly. C kites Are so much fun but don't suit everybody. But their low end is often not as good as bows. But I love c kites.
Ozone C4. Modern kite with all the good bits of a "C" and none of the bad bits. Anyone who's ridden one wants one.
