Just wondering how many people out there would like to see the Nats and other kite comps take on a different judging format into the future?
I'm thinking of something closer to the WWA (world wake associations) new format where a rider has to perform tricks from separate categories (such as spins, grabs (spin no more than 180), inverts, mobes) in the one run with overall impression and style playing a big factor in deciding a winner at the end of the heat.
I feel the current format of who ever can do the most pullups in one heat doesn't properly showcase kiteboarding in an enjoyable/viewable manner for the public and seems to neglect/score poorly things like Grabs and spins that can often be a lot harder to do than some mobes.
The world wake competitions got to a similar stage to where kiteboarding is at now, people were doing 15 mobes in a run and like kiteboarding is now it got super boring, unstylish and kinda lame. Once they changed to the new format a lot of interest from pros within the sport and outside sponsors was regained and it has no doubt progressed the sport to another level.
As a judge at this years nationals I think the judging criteria is something we need to seriously think about for subsequent competitions.
As a country lets be the leaders in the sport and show everyone how a comp can really be judged, not just another boring follow feller of world tour kiting.
p.s.
This isn't meant to be a post bashing the Nationals, I for one think it was an amazing comp and I thank all the hard work everyone (Gorge, Hook etc.) put into it!!!
I just feel this is something that needs to be talked about and changed
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I think the secret to kite comps is attracting the public. Makes sponsors more eager to give.
Public don't get the current range of tricks on display. A change is needed.
Current comps only impress kiters.....very small market.
I don't actually know what that means - just didn't like the sound of Rowdy being serious.
.....and you posted this revelation mr rowdy on a weather analysys website, lol a lot!
tomorrow start circulating flyers around byron bay backpacking hostels.
For once Rowdy has a point- it was very same same, amazing, but if I didn't kite I wouldn't have stayed long.
A grabbed front roll is more aesthetically pleasing than some of the faster squigglies.
A well thought out proposal Rowds.....I for one definitely agree- Wake Wars in Adelaide was amazing to watch because every run had a variety of tricks.
TBH I thought rowdy was making a blanket statement rather than a personal attack. Not sure if I agree with rowdy because the KPWT has something similar and that means they have to do board offs and stuff like that as other categories. If done properly I would quite like a 2-3 run format with maybe 7 tricks judged in each run and maybe 3-4 categories with only one rider on the water at the same time and the best run counts or maybe they keep their best 2 rounds.
I think more focus needs to be put into individual tricks and the quality of them rather than the quantity of them.
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I think a new format would be more interesting for spectators.
I had a friend come to watch the event and they knew nothing about kitesurfing but commented on two things.
a) When they saw Andy ride he was clearly ahead of the pack and easily the best rider.
BUT
b) liked the boosts that where done over the course racing buoy more than anything. because they perspective on height and distance.
Now if you can come up with a trick list that is equally as technical in retrospect as the handle passes and make some compulsory then this would satisfy both riders and crowd.
So if you said right best 8 tricks count but one would have to be a board off and another and air trick, then the other the more technical handle passes then it might make it more of a spectator sport.
Or maybe have points for technical and style and showmanship say.
It would work but it would also have to have bye in from the riders.
My two cents.
Rowdy has a point... a very valid point.
Exact specifics of the new or proposed format is always something that can be worked out down the track, but in essence this new suggestion has hit the nail on the head so to speak.
As a kiting community looking at putting on an event, there would be two ways to go in my opinion, a MAMBO style event, where the contest is judged by peers over numerous days and a Rowdy style event, judged by judges, for an audience both within and outside of the kiting world.
The exception to this rule, or even a slight variation would be non peer judged wave events, which would remain the same format, closely resembling competition surfing, whereby you are judged on your two best waves or rides for a set time period.
I think overall it's a suggestion that is worth consideration, cheers Rowdy
I have an idea, the format could be the same as the basketball shooting game "DONKEY" but change it to "OUT" So 3 chances instead of 6
Kiters compete in pairs against each other, loser drops "out".
One kiter follows another and has to copy the trick the lead kiter attempts. If it's landed they keep going until a trick is missed. Lead kiter throws a move, follower attempts to match it.
If all is matched, they keep going until someone misses a trick. If the lead kiter throws something and misses it, and the following kiter throws the same move and lands it. The lead kiter gets an "O" and then follows.
The new lead kiter then dictates what trick and leads off with a move, the follower has to match it to avoid a "U".
They keep challenging each other until one gets "OUT".
Just an idea.
The kiter who misses has to follow. The other lands gets a letter for each Kooked trick, three kooked tricks challenged by the lead kiter will result in the rider getting knocked O -U -T. So three chances.
If the lead kiter kooks an attempt, he must relinquish the lead position and follow his competitor and attempt the trick challenged by the lead kiter.
To keep it all bubbling along trick must be attempted from the repertoire of mobes, spins, grabs determined by the judges.
This format can be modified for intermediate or beginner comps by changing the repertire demanded by the judges.
intereting sir rowdalot! the format we're gonna use for the grm comp on saturday is similar to your prop. just not on the super elite level. to get more out of the day, test more skills and search for the all round super groms, we're gonna have heat scores judged on 4 factors.
1 best wave scored out of ten
2 best freestyle trick (/10)
3 Big Air (/10)
4 overall impression / style (/10)
each rider has a score out of 40 and top scorers go through to next round.
from this we can also get wave of the day, best trick, and rising star awards.
we're also gonna get teh groms doing a race - dash for cash held by the bikini babes.
Anyway sorry off topic- i have to agree with you on the principle of driving variety, needs to be done PKRA Style - by the rider for the riders. otherwise it will become out of date rapidly. viewers are where its at for events with viewers come sponsors then money, then professionalism, then reliability and quality.
Im bummed to have missed such a great event. next year!
^^^@ hirschausen
Terrible idea, promotes doing the trick safely and landing it at all costs. People will put their kites at 12 and there's no room for innovation.
Also doing boosts/kiteloops/boardoffs/dicktricks because spectators think it is cool is not progressing the sport. Talk to people who do similar board sports (cable and wakeboard in particular but also including skateboarding, snowboarding etc.) and they will tell you that they find the kite low wake stuff much more appealing than spin to win. Comps should be about wowing people with the tricks that are new and haven't been done before (i.e different grabs, more power, different rotation), not performing the same old **** that has been videod a million times and anyone can do.
Take any rider and they will do better stuff freeriding, comps should be rewarding high risk manouveres not safe riding ticking the boxes doing the same old **** a hundred spins to win.
@Kitethrills
So big air (not progressive) and waveriding (not progressive, at least not on a twin tip in crap waves) are going to make up half of your score where as the progressive stuff (freestyle, IMO) makes only a quarter of their score. Don't mix all the styles, it doesn't work.
I remember the nationals were held at Wanda beach in Sydney in 2001. There were big jumps and transitions which got the crowd going because of the 'wow' factor.
Whilst I love it no matter what they do I would like to see the wow factor back at the comps, even the Mambo, where there are just too many people on the water at once to try to go massive.
My 2c worth
so is best wave on a twin tip still.. or they gonna run free ride format, or wave heats??
Think alot of people are missing what rowdy is trying to get across.. hard in this sport though with so many different styles and preferences.. Get out the Old rollerblades
Rowdy is all over what is needed in kiting, definitely worth developing a comp format that is judging core trick against core trick where riders are judged on style, power and execution. The good riders will still be a level above others hitting tricks faster, bigger and of a much higher difficulty, but for the majority it gives a great competition format and gives riders something to go away and work on for the next comp. Right now IMO there is to much following and not enough focus on individual style and impression. By throwing a grab in instead of extra spin will be far more styled and for the most harder!
Saying this, I still believe we need a comp format that is closely linked to the PKRA to be able to provide a platform for riders to follow the world game in its current format. As international companies need tour riders on their books to be able to sell images of product performance etc etc...Once the world catches on to a better way, we will be ready and ahead of the pack!
We could have a run of a similar format at the Rail Jam in Mackay?
E.g....Pro division riders will have to hit obstacles and perform a number of flatwater based tricks to score heavily. Just doing one or the other will still score but it will have to be pretty solid riding to win overall?
The Am division, I think should mainly focus on rails as there is not much opportunity to get both tuition in rails and the opportunity to then practice and compete as well.
Just thoughts....
Be awesome if the AKL could run again, but with sliders at each stop also.
I think some people slightly misunderstood my idea but it's all good, nice to hear other peoples ideas on the subject.
p.s.
Most important part of a comp is having judges that understand and recognise the tricks and how hard they are (all of them) straight off the bat, if you look past this point it doesn't matter how good you make the comp you are going to get a stupid result, especially when it comes to judging a dangle against a powered/grabbed trick.
Nah,
Not a terrible idea, just AN IDEA. Terrible can be thrown around when it's been tried and you can say "that was terrible".
People have to land stuff - heck anyone can throw a tripple pass and miss the handle and everyone can go awwhh....
Your'e missing the point....progressive happens away from comps, freeriding.
I'm not agreeing with you on what you believe as "progressive" Progressing where? and by who's standards?. Wakeboarders???. Are we trying to get their approval or something? Dude....your'e a kiter not a tryhard wakeboarder right?.
Apologies, just a rant. No pain intended.
If I'm a competition freestyler I'll come to comp with my progressive moves tucked away, prove my worth with bread and butter 'boring' moves as you call them and then with the format idea I've suggested, I'd get my chance to be the lead kiter and throw something progressive, then another and then another BAM! competitor out.
Competition is about who's actually "better" than someone else. So therefore there needs to be a standard to measure against.
Again, not a terrible idea, just an idea.
But wait I have another idea!!...
No it's gone now....
WAIT!! It's back.....nah, last one was called terrible (sniff,sob)
