Hi guys can anyone tell me how the judging is likely to work regarding this issue for upcoming wave events. Found no mention of unstrapped riding in the rules. Obviously it will be easier for tricks with straps, will all competitors be forced to use them to be competitive?
Funny you may mention this. I have been talking with Ian the organiser of the Lennox comp about this very matter recently.
My opinions on the matter at hand is that;
1. Unstrapped requires undoubtably more control, skill and finesse than strapped.
2. Strapped allows for more turns to be made in whatever part of the wave you like and for errors in riding to be easily corrected.
It is my opinion that straps are the training wheels of the surfboard. I don't think there would be to many people that can ride both well that would dispute this fact.
HOWEVER... That doesn't automatically mean because you are unstrapped you should beat anyone who is strapped no matter the circumstances.
You will still have to out-surf the other rider, you have to prove your skills in the conditions and provide a better mix of skill, style, power and technicality than the other surfer.
If you go out unstrapped and fall off every wave, you will LOSE.
If you go out strapped and do the most turns, you will not automatically WIN.
I think people (kiteboarders in general) seem to be of the mentality that the more turns you do on a wave the more points you will get... This couldn't be further from what it should be, however I have seen it happen at comps all to many times before.
Nothing is set in stone as of yet, but to the best of my knowledge I believe the judging format will be set for overall impression. i.e. Style, power, originallity of moves etc.
The WINNER will be the person with the best overall impression on the judges, not the guy who does the most S-turns and not the guy who is just unstrapped.
You need to make what you do stand out! I think this will make for a far more entertaining comp and riders will be less focused on tallying up points and more focused on showing what they can do and how they have the most fun.
Obviously Un-strapped will play a role in this decision of overall impression. Someone doing a regular turn strapped is far less impressive than someone doing the same thing un-strapped. So if you are planning on riding the training hooks, you better be prepared to blow up and make it count, merely utilising them to make the maxim of turns on the wave will not automatically declare you the winner.
p.s.
If it were up to me, unstrapped and strapped would be totally separate divisions because I feel it is to hard on judges having to make decisions on one or the other and if there were a division for each they would be far more focused on the surfing...
I hope so, because they will go hard do some amasing boost and push the limit instead of attempting to look like an ugly surfer who can do some little bunny hops.
Grab anyone who has no knowledge of kiting,place him on the beach and ask him which one look more spectacular.
I have memories of a recent wave competition in WA with some awesome unstrapped boost, a lot of ranting in those forums and a few impressive pics.
They simply forgot to admit that he didn't land one
Until strapless kiters can pull more amasing ****, I don't see the point and it is such a shame that all the best kiters seem to adhere to this farce.
One judging criteria for all, the most critical manoeuvre in the most critical part of the wave
and if you want to be happy with the freedom and flow of not wearing straps, tough titties
Yeah well grab anyone who has no knowledge of kiting, place him on the beach and ask him which one look more spectacular - a dude riding a wave or - a guy with a twin tip doing a big boost?...
We all know the punter is going to say the twin tip guy, so should we just make this a contest about boosting off waves instead?... NO.
Your logic is totally flawed. The comp isn't solely run to entertain the public and it isn't to decide the best rider based on what someone who has no idea about kiting thinks. The objective of a comp is to place the best rider on that day in the winning position and (in my eyes) to progress the sport.
Formats need to be more focussed on progression or otherwise you just have the best safe consistent rider winning, which is even more boring for judges/spectators and equally boring for competitors.
Comps should be about pushing yourself and bettering the sport.
The mind boggles with possibilities
a) What if my straps are super loose so it's nearly the same as unstrapped??????????
b) What if I only wear 1 strap???????????
c) If had straps that were clear silicon or skin coloured would that be cheating??????
d) Do you get less points for wearing a leg rope as well????????
e) If I had a ****ty old board or kite that required more skill to ride, will I get more points????????
Rowdy- "straps are the training wheels of surfboards". That's a big call. I'm sure there's some big wave riders at lennox and margaret river that may disagree. Each to their own though 
Great call, count me in, I have an old skim board in the shed and if I back it with my old rooted naish kite with a tear in the trailing edge, I am pretty much guaranteed to win.
I can still go back and forth and clear the white froth.
Watch out, I am coming
Does that mean Boots are the training wheels for wakestyle?
I guess this year the PKRA will be scoring more for kiters using straps.
Pearl has a logical point.
Large waves, powerful riding requires straps.
Surfers would love to have straps on their boards to be more explosive, I WOULD!
But its not practical to paddle and the exact strap positioning is random on a 6 foot plus board.
Tow surfers need high performance equipment, Smaller boards are easier to control at speed and they're a lot faster. Faster board speeds requires straps.
Last time I checked I believe we are being towed by a kite and we all have the magic opportunities to ride at blazing high speeds?
Sorry Rowdy and all other body draggers passionately involved, strapless riding belongs to the skimboard, wake skate, (low powered, low speed wanna pretend they are doing another sport) divisions.
Hey Rowdy come down to Margs and tell Dreu and the boys they're using "training wheels"!!! you'd be laughed off the beach...
No One is doing turns like them strapless!!
Most kitesurfers cant read waves. Most kitesurfers would fall of the back of waves when doing their turns without the aid of the kite. Most high level surfers who kitesurf hate the issue of not being able to subtly move their feet whilst on the wave. Everything Rowdy said I totally agree on in relation to push the progression of the sport, cause that what a comp is about. This is not a straps Vs strapless as in certain conditions, riding strapless is vertually impossible.
Constant rabble from people who no nothing about what it takes to get barreled on a surfboard, the many ways to go around a section and who surfboard design means nothing will desintegrate this thread into the same old chestnut.
I don't think boards or straps should be taken into account. It should purely be on wave choice, positioning, style and all the usual criteria. If it turns out that riding unstrapped puts you in a better position, gets you barrelled or what ever then that will be reflected. But to score based on looking at the dudes feet to work out if they are strapped in or not to me seems silly. Sure, as pearl said, where does the riding handicapped stopped. Just on straps, or should it be going on fins, boards size..... Seems a bad idea to me. Let the riders be judged on the same criteria and not some handicapped system. If riding with straps is a massive advantage, sure, use them in competition to win if thats what it takes, and ride unstrapped if you like freekiting if that rocks your boat.
NR that is like saying why should surfer be handicapped by making them paddle in when they can be towed in.
Half the skill is in wave selection and positioning yourself.
And the skill in riding untrapped is def something that needs to be taken into account when scoring.
Suppose it just depends on if you want to only progress straped ridin.
We should be promoting wave riding irrespective of strap choice.
I don't think you guys properly read what I wrote.
To summarise:
You will not win just because you are un-strapped.
You will not win just because you are strapped and provide more turns, than another rider.
The waverider with the best overall impression will win.
I know personally straps can cramp a good riders style and unstrapped can be equally challenging in certain conditions, you will obviously be able to use both of these to your advantage, in different conditions. However your perfomance on the day will be the defining factor.
This isn't actually the judging format as of yet and I am not going to be judging. However I know 2 of the judges, 1 will be a windsurfer who can kite and the other is a really good skater who can surf and is learning to kite. So at least those 2 judges should be very much un-biased.
p.s.
I don't really care who is on the beach, I will tell anyone straps are the training wheels, because they are, "wakestyle" included. One day things will be different but until then you at least need to try and progress the sport (if thats what you like doing), straps aren't the future and if they were I guarantee you the future would be full of PKRA danglers doing mobes above waves... now that paints a horrible picture in my head.
In fact last Lennox comp me and happy rode straps, we just mucked around did aerial 360s, 180s and other flips and spins just to prove how easy and silly it is. We came 2nd and 4th respectively. In no way do I feel what we did was progressive, it was learnt in a day and landed almost every try.
Don't worry I have expressed this view many a time to the locals at Lennox (who are my friends) they know how I feel everyone knows how I feel. Like it or hate it, thats my stance you can make up your own minds and decisions what to ride, both have their fun points.
I see them as 2 different disciplines vaguely like tow surfing vs paddle surfing
A heat with a strapped rider vs an unstrapped rider therefore seems rediculous to me personally. Its subjective enough already let alone mixing them up.
Unstrapped can be epic and much closer to paddle surfing for point scoring, but also i find there are setups of wind angle to wave angle and wind amount - add some face chop and steep large faces - add in rapid acceleration you get from the kite from already moving fast on the wave/apparent wind (you just cannot help it with some angles) - and you have the straps to help you stay in position and not take you out of control.
they are just different disciplines, it seems unfair to mix em in a comp and pointless to say one is better than the other based on the kind of waves you are used to at your local
In most wave comps choice of equipment has no bearing on the score. As soon as you mention straps/no straps/hooked/unhooked it ends up in arguments and nobody wins.
Not everyone agrees. But it makes things simple.
Its very hard to judge kite surfing comps on surfing criteria because the kite is always there and in ballistic conditions, straps are almost compulsory.
I would hate to be the one setting the judging criterior.
I remember when Aaron Jarman won the Lennox wave comp strapped and on a Peter Lynn. He still made everyone else look like a gumby!!
No matter what the criteria, cream rises to the top!
^^^ I also remember that and I have to disagree. Aaron is a good rider but 20 boring cutbacks every wave shouldn't win you a comp. That comp was even more backwards than usual because even the strapped up guys doing airs and unique combination of stuff didn't beat a strapped rider doing 20 turns.
My dad was one of the judges at that particular comp and said the other judges were meerly making a tick for every maneuver or turn made on a wave... thus progressive riding pretty much did nothing for you, the more cutbacks you did the more points you got. Aaron played well to the scoring critera, and took the comp. (although it wasn't communicated that this was the criteria).
maybe we can have a prefix on every ID, KTS (kiter that surfs) or STK (surfer that kites) or maybe SAF (straps are fine) or SAFS(straps are for suks) or IDGAF (i don't give a F$%K).... would avoid the same hoary old chestnut of opinion that surfaces every time this topic comes up, boils down to if you are going hard and having a dig you'll get a gong, nothing sadder than amateur athletes blowing up at the organisers and checking the judging sheets
Happy to abide by the guys at lennox that do the organising and whatever their criteria, opinion is (when in rome) ...anyone that is good enough to volunteer their time(and the resultant criticism) to be a judge/organiser deserves free beer
me, i like the lennox comp because the vibe is good ,the locals are friendly ,the pub is close and i get to bull**** to friends i haven't seen in a while!!
, I'm glad someone recognises that these days.
, I'm glad someone recognises that these days.
Yes well that is obviously the second motive for running a comp, the first being getting everyone together to get sloppy as sh!t.
.
they need to be two diffrent divisions or two different comps! fullstop.
In tow surfing, unstrapped big wave tube riding is considered crazier than with straps. And is preferred by many.
The current pro surfing criteria would be the best judging format for progression, but the comparing of two different ways of riding is like saying that bannana is more progressive for fruit salad than that orange is for orange juice.
Maybe a rule of over 6 foot, edit 8 foot straps go on???
Sure he pulled into some slabs... full credit... but he ain't smashin the lip as hard.. or as critical...as you can strapped.... go check some of the footage of Dreu in th world championships in Peru... strapped stylish no danglely ****..smashin it in the pocket...
Maybe it's got more to do with soft east coast waves and you are bored
You weren't there, trust me he hit the lip as hard as anyone. A lot of what happened there wasn't on film including some really good waves he had... always how it is I guess. And I really don't think straps are going to help you hit the lip at that place, hitting the lip is almost impossible as it is, one second its nothing the next second its over the top of you.
If only I had straps on this one I might have been able to hit the lip harder...
p.s.
I don't mean to sound rude but the footage I have seen of Dreu doesn't really do much for me. I would have thought being the surfer that he is, unstrapped would be more of a challenge and a thrill for him.
So you are saying that strap do not give you the capacity to hit the waves harder????
You must not be quite the full can of coke mate
I give up, I will never win this argument.
Let me guess,do you wear bordies over your wetty
No I actually agree with you on this one Sebol, they give you the capacity to over exaggerate and wreck any real flow that might still be contained under a fully powered kite.
Why would I wear Boardies over a steamer?, I'm not a euro.
