Hey everyone,
Has anyone had any issues with sellers advertising one thing and then sending something different from the buy/sell section of this site?
I have unfortunately bought what was advertised as a 2009 kite in good condition from interstate only to receive a 2006 kite in not so good condition.
I have tried to contact the seller in various forms including phone and with no reply. I have noticed that this seller still has another kite advertised in the buy/sell section. Perhaps we need a rating system of buyers and sellers to warn other users of this site.
Thoughts? Experiences? Advice?
Yeah I have. Laurie said that if there is ongoing fraudulent activity then they could be banned. Laurie also said that the guy hadn't logged onto the site since he removed the initial advert after sale. So not much that can be done at this stage apparently.
I had a similar issue, i purchased a kite that was advertised as in good condition, with a few professional repairs. was in terrible condition and was only repaired with old sand clad repair tape. some of the holes were 30cm in length and had 8 in total.
rating system sounds great to me.
However the best rating system of all is to either look at the kite yourself before purchase, purchase second hand from a store (they normally have some kind of quality testing system for second hand gear and sometimes offer warranty) or if none of the above ask for as many pictures as you can, of every inch of the kite, often if the kite is in poor condition the seller will be reluctant to send lots of pics and that will ring alarm bells straight away.
After my experience i now ask for detailed pictures of all the known wear spots on a kite, bar and lines, as well as detailed pictures of any repairs and information of who did the repairs.
sorry to hear it i hope you can sort something out
a rating system is not really fair to those sellers who are new or rarely sell anything and have no rating. plus the shop pimps could set up bogus sales just to top up their positive feedback.
Rating system may not work because the offender could simply use a new username. Unless IP addresses are tracked?
Unfortunately it's a case of "buyer beware".
I agree stamp but im sure Laurie will be able to come up with a solution, we manage to get by as nearly everyone on the buy and sell section is great to deal with (myexperience over the years) . All it takes is for a few users to really start selling bad goods for the reputation to fall and the nightmare of ebay kitesurfing to gain momentum.
Caveat Emptor!
Unfortunately this seems to be becoming a common problem on the forums that I've seen. And there is little that the forum mods can do except ban the offender after the fact. Which is little solace to those ripped off. And no guarantee the offender won't be back with a new user name.
If you can't see the item first hand, try to get someone trustworthy to look at it for you. Failing that, as Maxiy said, get as many photos as possible (though there is no guarantee they will be of the item you get).
And pay for the item either with paypal or even better, COD.
If a deal seems to good to be true, it probably is.
Good luck sorting it out.
If you are buying from anyone in Perth "Kite Surf SUP" would be happy to have the seller bring the kite in for assessment along the lines of the way we check every 2nd hand kite we put on the shelf - including those on consignment.
Our kite assessment regime is:
- a 3 hr inflation test.
- check every bridle line for equal length (we dont work from brand spec advice - too complicated).
- record % of wear on parts like 'P'Lines.
- check every panel & record damage or repairs.
- check the LE & record damage or repairs.
- assess the usage in terms of % of life used (pretty arbitary but we do our best)
- record any signs of excessive wear & tear.
Our Bar Test
- check line lengths are equal (not many arent equal lines any more)
- check the full length of every line for any knots or cuts or weaknesses
- check all pigtails are colour coded correctly & that knots & loops match the kite.
- check the safety mechanism is appro & working.
- check that the safety release action follows thru to depower.
- record the % wear & tear of all lines individually.
We could also offer a market value assessment based on the prices we have to work to to put 2nd hand in the 'worth buying' category in our own ads.
Id suggest that if a seller wasnt prepared to have the kite assessed you could be pretty sure he/she is either sure of its condition & value & saleability or there is reason for you to be wary.
All this for free - if we find it is valuable enough to both buyer & seller we may look at charging a fee sometime down the track. It generally takes the best part of 45 mins to an hr from packed to checked & repacked so thinking $50 would be reasonable if ppl want it?
I agree - an enormous % of sellers on SB are 100% reliable but theres always the cheats.
You should see some of the kites newbys come in with that they bought "for an absolute bargain" off Gumtree or Ebay.
Latest was a "hardly used" 14M Naish Aero on a 55cm unmatched Bar. This was "the perfect beginner kite" for 2 x 65/70kg learners to get started on. Apparently the seller had "no problem teaching myself on it" and he must have been fair dinkum because "it wasnt even trashed" !!!!
Happens all the time.
Not cool,
Take piccys and post them please. How did you pay if it was sent to you? You hopefully have a sender's address.
Ive used the buy and sell for years and never had a problem, but mostly sold stuff always to people who come to see it. I will not sell any kite to a total beginner who has not had lessons, thats easy to tell on the phone before they get there. Ive had an ad on for 5 days at the most, 80% is gone within 48 hours.
Yort, good luck mate. Seems this will take a lot of your time to sort out. Bummer
Some hints on buying a second hand kite.......
See it, be patient until something is avaliable.
Bring a spray bottle with some detergent in it.
Check the trailing edge of the kite, stretches, thin fabric will give you use.
Check the pigtail attachments, another sign of wear.
Blow the canopy up hard, 10psi, and spray leading edge and struts.
Check the bar and lines, roll them out, are they even, are they the bar for the kite?
Not trying to sound condesending more educate anyone on how to get what they pay for. This is the process that every kiteshop I know does before they even accept a trade-in.
EDIT: Bloody puppet, pimped my ride
Always ask for pictures, that way at least you have an idea what you are getting, don't be shy to ask for pictures of values , leading edge, bar lines whatever you want if they are keen on selling the kite for a good price this is easily done. Almost everyone has a phone the can send photos these days.... 
Rating systems do work, other sites I have used require 50 proper forum posts, not just drivel, before u can advertise at all. Then poor feedback requires a dialogue between buyer and seller, moderated by mods/site owner, else seller is banned.
In the absence of that, and the fact he is not a serial fraudulent offender so laurie can't help, and the fact he has not answered your queries, yes I agree with default - name and shame.
Seabreeze has been the safest online gear selling ever, in part due to a small market in a small country and most of us know each other, and problems here are rare..... so when the w^nkers come along they need to be outed 
What's with the dude that has ozone kites for sale at nutter prices and says 'details to follow shortly' and no details seem to arrive??
Sorry to hear... Just for the record I've always received good quality products from seabreeze buy and sell. Most have been without seeing the item first. I am always a little worried until I receive the kite. Have found a good chat on the phone with a bunch of questions has been enough to judge the seller. I would be guttered handing over hard earned for a lemon!! Don't give up!!! hunt him down, and be a VERY squeaky wheel[}:)]
eBay is a prime example of how a profile, rating, feedback systems builds trust and peace of mind.
Would just like to add that my previous comment was a one off incident for me. I also have had a very good experience OVERALL with seabreeze, both as a forum poster and a purchaser of equipment.
I unfortunately had that one bad experience, but it has not made me loose my faith in the SB buy and sell, just made me slightly more careful with my purchases 
All I can add is that it's extremely rare.
The last instance I got informed of was Sir V & friend 12+ months ago, which turned out to be that the item was lost by Aus Post (also extremely rare!)
In addition to tips above, getting photo's are the best way to "see" it first...
AND what about the numerous times enquiring about an advertised item only to be told "oh that has gone, ... but I just happen to have another you should be interested in ..."
Sound familiar? It appears to happen more often north of the sunny border. Probably stems from dealers/shops that keep the same advert going rather than changing for each item? Could be more honest up front IMO and declare that they are simply advertising their shop.
I am not infering they peddle dud deals.
Fair trade blahhh, photos first blahhh.
Go to your local shop!
they all have tonnes of 2nd hand gear, you can feel, touch, rub, smell as much as you want.
And if there is any issues, guess what??? you can go back there.
seems a hard task to some, but believe me it works.
Yort and Maxiy, NAME and SHAME please.
Some of us have moderate google skillz and might be able to turn up some other info to help you track down seller.
I am more than happy to spend some time helping if I had something to go on.
PS I have bought/sold a number of things and both parties satisfied every time, as good or better than described. 
All well and good.
But if the guy is a genuine Knoob or has NFI then hey may think its a 2009.
Especially if he is selling it for a second time.
Good luck
